Wiring on a 1997 228G

[Double Eagle]

I have accumulated numerous smaller gage wires like 16 ga. or less that need to be hooked to one or the other batteries. I would like to put these wires on some kind of a terminal strip and run a hot wire from my batterie selector switch to power them. This way when my switch is off I will know that all power is killed and something is not on and putting a drain on the batteries. Does any one have any ideas on a terminal strip or a good way to even run power to a terminal strip.

 

[ocnslr]

If you take a new power lead from the battery, or from the output terminal of your battery selector switch, it must have a circuit breaker within three feet of the source.

You can run that to a single buss power strip, mounted either aft or more likely at your console/helm area. Make sure you use marine-grade wire (not home or auto), and adequate wire gauge to minimize voltage drop.

There are wire size tables that are based on 10% voltage drop. I prefer the tables based on 3% voltage drop.

You might want to use a dual buss bar like this one for both positive and negative connections:
http://bluesea.com/products/2702

Use this to select the wire gauge. Make sure you use the two-way distance...
http://www.westmarine.com/pdf/MarineWire.pdf

Brian

 

[BobP]

Double E -

if any of these wires run to your bilge pumps or battery charger, leave it connected directly to the battery. All these leads, of course, need to be fused if they are not.

You may also have a galvanic isolator DC feed which allows indicator light function / alarm for abnormal conditions, and a memory feed to the AM/FM radio. These also shouldn't be switched if you want the intended function.

If you have an emergency DC feeder as my Sailfish has, it is intended to be an express supply - bypassing all the usual devices that can go bad and leave you w/o aux power.

 

[jehines3]

I take a completely different approach. Nothing is wired direct to a battery post excpet the single cable that goes to the battery switch (or my 200A negative bus), and the motor negatives to each respective battery.

I run a #8 tinned Cu with ring lug direct to the back of the battery switch (BEP marine 717 Cluster with charge relays) then to a Blue seas 5025 (6 circuit with negative bus and cover). Each battery gets a dedicated 24 hour panel located within 1'-2' of the batteries. I have my bilge pumps, galvanic isolators, three bank battery charger, stereo memory, etc. wired to these smaller sub fuse panels so that all circuits are fused including the charger within 3' of the battery. Most people do not protect their charger wiring properly. The fuse should be located close to the battery, not relying on the internal fuse in the charger, which leaves the entire run suseptible to chafe/fire loss.

Each subcircuit is nicely labled on the fuse cover and spares in the panel for each of my bilge pumps.

I can't stand the rats nest of wires people land directly onto a battery post. Its dangerous and rarely results in good tight connections for all circuits connected. USE GOOD MARINE WIRE, TINNED IS BEST.

I can post pics if you wish, this was just completed right after I bought the boat this season. It cost me about $300 in parts but that was mostly the battery cluster. jh


http://bluesea.com/files/images/product_lines/126.png

http://www.bepmarine.com/Twin-Outboards ... -1465.html

 

[jimmy's marine service]

terrible advice !!!

Double E -

if any of these wires run to your bilge pumps or battery charger, leave it connected directly to the battery. All these leads, of course, need to be fused if they are not.

You may also have a galvanic isolator DC feed which allows indicator light function / alarm for abnormal conditions, and a memory feed to the AM/FM radio. These also shouldn't be switched if you want the intended function.

If you have an emergency DC feeder as my Sailfish has, it is intended to be an express supply - bypassing all the usual devices that can go bad and leave you w/o aux power.

terrible advice,no offense there big guy...but...you don't want to make any,and i mean any connections at a battery except for battery cables running for the engine ground and the battery switch...you want to make all power connections behind the battery switches...
as far as wire is concerned,brian,"ocnsir" mentioned "use marine grade wire.." excellent advice,however,the boat came from the factory with common automotive wire,it's NOT marine grade,nor is it tinned...
no offense to anyone..but...when i see posts like this one asking for electrical help,with vague refferences,and asking some pretty basic questions,i get real scared...reason being,if you're unsure about wires,what else are you unsure of ??? how do you plan to connect the wires ??? asking for advice on a message board is kinda like asking a perfect stranger to pick lottery numbers for you,look at the advice you got allready :wink: :wink: when it comes to electrical systems,i highly reccomend you seek the services of a qualified individual.again,no offense,but it's like this,if you're gotta ask very basic questions,you certainly are going to get yourself in trouble really fast...granted,it's not like launching a space shuttle or performing brain surgery,but it does require a basic working knowledge...i've seen some repairs attempted by customers,with some help from the internet,it would've cost them much less if they brought it in to my shop in the first place.... :wink: just some friendly advice...
what i'm real curious abot is,exactly how did these small guage wires appear ????

 

[jehines3]

See here:
http://www.gradywhite.com/customer/manu ... 26_228.pdf

Page 6-5 (page 43 in the pdf) on have the original factory set-up for your boat.

I'd add two 24 hour panels adjacent to the battery swich for bilge pump float switches and charger if you have one. Tie this into the switch for 24 hour availible power for these devices. I'd wire each bilge pump to a seperate battery. My forward pump is my primary, therfore it gets my house (biggest) battery.

Everything else should be just as the factory had done it originally. jh

 

[BobP]

The good thing about sites like this, one is free to request advise and follow or ignore any advise they receive of varying opinions, for any reason whatsoever, or from anyone in particular too.

That's ok with me. As usual, my advise stands, for competent DIYers only.

I'll leave it at that.

 

[Double Eagle]

Evey one has their own opinion and that is what I am looking for. I do work for a very large construction company and my dept is involved with the electrical and the electronics dept. I do have experience with wiring and what it takes to work in pure hell conditions. It never hurts to ask questions and look at what others have done or the advice that they may have. I have not checked all of these wires but I do know what some of them do and I do know there is a much better way to it. Some of the wires go to my down riggers, one goes to a depth finder, one goes to a speed control on my trolling motor and not sure as of yet where the rest go. I would think that some would go to bilge pumps but I will have to check. I just hate seeing a mess of wires hooked to the battery post. I think that most of them have inline fuses. I just pulled the live well tank out and have exposed the area where all of the wires are and pulled both of my batteries. Now it is time to start figuring out where all of the wires go that need cleaned up. I guess that I should be looking at a type of a fuse panel for a cleaner set up. Right now it looks like I will mount it in behind the live well out of sight, but there again that might be the worst place to put it. If there is going to be fuses it should be where I can check them if there is a problem. So as you can see I am just getting started.

 

[catch22]

How about this;

http://www.boatersworld.com/product/196 ... ttery-accs

 

[Grog]

How about this;

http://www.boatersworld.com/product/196 ... ttery-accs

That would be OK for non essential loads but definitely wouldn't trust it on a bilge pump.

 

[jimmy's marine service]

cheap junk !!!

How about this;

http://www.boatersworld.com/product/196 ... ttery-accs

would not use that kind of crap on a bet....making connections at the batteries,is not the best approach...do a search of my posts,you should find wiring and proper wiring guide lines in them...using cheap mickey mouse set ups like this thing is really asking for trouble....

 

[BobP]

Double ..,

in light of the further info you provided and the experience you have, if you want something very simple but effective, you can take all these fused leads (with waterproof fuse holders only), take all the tails of the leads and crimp them together into one larger size lug. If you need to disconnect any individual one later, pull out the fuse and close up the holder. I have two threaded studs off each battery terminal, so the lighter smaller gauge lugs are together on one, and the heavier #2 AWG lugs are together on the other. Since you know you can only have so many lugs under one nut, it can get difficult to find enough studs.

Since you have the right experience, I expect you will know how to pick a lug of the right size and use the right crimping tool so that all of the leads are properly secured. Be sure to add heat shrinks and use tinned copper lugs not the bare copper ones used in the construction trades.

Saltwater reaps havoc with bare copper.

Grady use a coated copper wire that was well protected and less costly than tin plated, but tin plated is the best since you don't have to clear off the coating to make termiations, and when being around saltwater.

 

[jimmy's marine service]

scary stuff right here....

Double ..,

in light of the further info you provided and the experience you have, if you want something very simple but effective, you can take all these fused leads (with waterproof fuse holders only), take all the tails of the leads and crimp them together into one larger size lug. If you need to disconnect any individual one later, pull out the fuse and close up the holder. I have two threaded studs off each battery terminal, so the lighter smaller gauge lugs are together on one, and the heavier #2 AWG lugs are together on the other. Since you know you can only have so many lugs under one nut, it can get difficult to find enough studs.

Since you have the right experience, I expect you will know how to pick a lug of the right size and use the right crimping tool so that all of the leads are properly secured. Be sure to add heat shrinks and use tinned copper lugs not the bare copper ones used in the construction trades.
Saltwater reaps havoc with bare copper.

Grady use a coated copper wire that was well protected and less costly than tin plated, but tin plated is the best since you don't have to clear off the coating to make termiations, and when being around saltwater.

you're kidding me right ??? the more i read from you,the more scared i become...your advice is insane,you really need to stop giving advice when you clearly have no clue...anyone,and i mean anyone who follows your advice is asking for trouble...
i can't imagine what a mess your boat must be...is it insured ??? when was the last survey ??? i read things you post,and i truly try to keep an open mind,however,the more i read,the more i can't believe what i read from you..."strip all the leads then crimp them all together into a battery lug"...WTF ??? "diy" isn't that what you call yourself ??? mabey you should try this one "dangerous"...or mabey this one "don't let common sense get in your way"...
i have absolutley no problem giving guys advice,and i've no problem with guys working on their own rigs,my problem comes in when someone who clearly lacks any knowledge or idea of the right way,the accepted way to repair things,gives their 2 cents,which is quite wrong...what happens is others will follow this route,thinking it's an accepted way of doing things,then when a later date arrives and there's problems,someone with the proper knowledge and experience explains the problem,and tells exactly what's wrong and why it's wrong,along with exactly what caused a problem...
i'm not sure what you do or you did for a living,i'm guessing you're an older guy,but i suggest you stick with what you know,'cause clearly,you don't know too much about marine systems and the like,your words prove my point...you're probably a nice old guy,probably retired too,do yourself a favor,stick to giving advice about the proper golf swing,leave boats,and motors to someone who knows what they're doing.... :wink: :wink:

 

[Double Eagle]

Jimmy, what do you think about the Blue Seas fuse box deal. I don't boat in the salt water nor do I ever think that I will. My other question is I know I will pull my positive from my battery selector switch but where do I catch a common ground. Do I run a ground wire from each of my batteries of pick it up some where else. How do I do a search of your post? I am also looking at running wires for a windlass and for motors on a planner board mast. Might as well do it right from the start.

 

[Grog]

Your common isn't common? How do you charge both batteries?


BobP I don't want to jump on the bash wagon but that is just asking for trouble.

 

[jimmy's marine service]

interesting...

Your common isn't common? How do you charge both batteries?


BobP I don't want to jump on the bash wagon but that is just asking for trouble.

not quite sure what and who you're asking....

if you're asking me...i charge both batteries via sense relays...i use seperate switches for the engines and the 12v systems...use the search function...i explain alot of stuff in great detail...

 

[catch22]

Re: scary stuff right here....

Double ..,

in light of the further info you provided and the experience you have, if you want something very simple but effective, you can take all these fused leads (with waterproof fuse holders only), take all the tails of the leads and crimp them together into one larger size lug. If you need to disconnect any individual one later, pull out the fuse and close up the holder. I have two threaded studs off each battery terminal, so the lighter smaller gauge lugs are together on one, and the heavier #2 AWG lugs are together on the other. Since you know you can only have so many lugs under one nut, it can get difficult to find enough studs.

Since you have the right experience, I expect you will know how to pick a lug of the right size and use the right crimping tool so that all of the leads are properly secured. Be sure to add heat shrinks and use tinned copper lugs not the bare copper ones used in the construction trades.
Saltwater reaps havoc with bare copper.

Grady use a coated copper wire that was well protected and less costly than tin plated, but tin plated is the best since you don't have to clear off the coating to make termiations, and when being around saltwater.

you're kidding me right ??? the more i read from you,the more scared i become...your advice is insane,you really need to stop giving advice when you clearly have no clue...anyone,and i mean anyone who follows your advice is asking for trouble...
i can't imagine what a mess your boat must be...is it insured ??? when was the last survey ??? i read things you post,and i truly try to keep an open mind,however,the more i read,the more i can't believe what i read from you..."strip all the leads then crimp them all together into a battery lug"...WTF ??? "diy" isn't that what you call yourself ??? mabey you should try this one "dangerous"...or mabey this one "don't let common sense get in your way"...
i have absolutley no problem giving guys advice,and i've no problem with guys working on their own rigs,my problem comes in when someone who clearly lacks any knowledge or idea of the right way,the accepted way to repair things,gives their 2 cents,which is quite wrong...what happens is others will follow this route,thinking it's an accepted way of doing things,then when a later date arrives and there's problems,someone with the proper knowledge and experience explains the problem,and tells exactly what's wrong and why it's wrong,along with exactly what caused a problem...
i'm not sure what you do or you did for a living,i'm guessing you're an older guy,but i suggest you stick with what you know,'cause clearly,you don't know too much about marine systems and the like,your words prove my point...you're probably a nice old guy,probably retired too,do yourself a favor,stick to giving advice about the proper golf swing,leave boats,and motors to someone who knows what they're doing.... :wink: :wink:

Nothing but insults. An absolute disgrace!

 

[Double Eagle]

What do you mean how do I charge my batteries. My boat motor charges them when I am running or my trolling motor when I am trolling. I have a two battery system from the factory and I have always ran both batteries at the same time. Should I be alternating batteries say like every other week. I boat once a week and I trailer my boat. My boat is always inside except when fishing. Sense I don't dock my boat my battery use is probably different than most. If I stated my ground question wrong then where does the ground come from for my fused terminal panel??

 

[Gross Profit]

Re: scary stuff right here....

Double ..,

in light of the further info you provided and the experience you have, if you want something very simple but effective, you can take all these fused leads (with waterproof fuse holders only), take all the tails of the leads and crimp them together into one larger size lug. If you need to disconnect any individual one later, pull out the fuse and close up the holder. I have two threaded studs off each battery terminal, so the lighter smaller gauge lugs are together on one, and the heavier #2 AWG lugs are together on the other. Since you know you can only have so many lugs under one nut, it can get difficult to find enough studs.

Since you have the right experience, I expect you will know how to pick a lug of the right size and use the right crimping tool so that all of the leads are properly secured. Be sure to add heat shrinks and use tinned copper lugs not the bare copper ones used in the construction trades.
Saltwater reaps havoc with bare copper.

Grady use a coated copper wire that was well protected and less costly than tin plated, but tin plated is the best since you don't have to clear off the coating to make termiations, and when being around saltwater.

you're kidding me right ??? the more i read from you,the more scared i become...your advice is insane,you really need to stop giving advice when you clearly have no clue...anyone,and i mean anyone who follows your advice is asking for trouble...
i can't imagine what a mess your boat must be...is it insured ??? when was the last survey ??? i read things you post,and i truly try to keep an open mind,however,the more i read,the more i can't believe what i read from you..."strip all the leads then crimp them all together into a battery lug"...WTF ??? "diy" isn't that what you call yourself ??? mabey you should try this one "dangerous"...or mabey this one "don't let common sense get in your way"...
i have absolutley no problem giving guys advice,and i've no problem with guys working on their own rigs,my problem comes in when someone who clearly lacks any knowledge or idea of the right way,the accepted way to repair things,gives their 2 cents,which is quite wrong...what happens is others will follow this route,thinking it's an accepted way of doing things,then when a later date arrives and there's problems,someone with the proper knowledge and experience explains the problem,and tells exactly what's wrong and why it's wrong,along with exactly what caused a problem...
i'm not sure what you do or you did for a living,i'm guessing you're an older guy,but i suggest you stick with what you know,'cause clearly,you don't know too much about marine systems and the like,your words prove my point...you're probably a nice old guy,probably retired too,do yourself a favor,stick to giving advice about the proper golf swing,leave boats,and motors to someone who knows what they're doing.... :wink: :wink:

Nothing but insults. An absolute disgrace!

good ole' Jimmy

 

[jimmy's marine service]

Re: scary stuff right here....

Double ..,

in light of the further info you provided and the experience you have, if you want something very simple but effective, you can take all these fused leads (with waterproof fuse holders only), take all the tails of the leads and crimp them together into one larger size lug. If you need to disconnect any individual one later, pull out the fuse and close up the holder. I have two threaded studs off each battery terminal, so the lighter smaller gauge lugs are together on one, and the heavier #2 AWG lugs are together on the other. Since you know you can only have so many lugs under one nut, it can get difficult to find enough studs.

Since you have the right experience, I expect you will know how to pick a lug of the right size and use the right crimping tool so that all of the leads are properly secured. Be sure to add heat shrinks and use tinned copper lugs not the bare copper ones used in the construction trades.
Saltwater reaps havoc with bare copper.

Grady use a coated copper wire that was well protected and less costly than tin plated, but tin plated is the best since you don't have to clear off the coating to make termiations, and when being around saltwater.

you're kidding me right ??? the more i read from you,the more scared i become...your advice is insane,you really need to stop giving advice when you clearly have no clue...anyone,and i mean anyone who follows your advice is asking for trouble...
i can't imagine what a mess your boat must be...is it insured ??? when was the last survey ??? i read things you post,and i truly try to keep an open mind,however,the more i read,the more i can't believe what i read from you..."strip all the leads then crimp them all together into a battery lug"...WTF ??? "diy" isn't that what you call yourself ??? mabey you should try this one "dangerous"...or mabey this one "don't let common sense get in your way"...
i have absolutley no problem giving guys advice,and i've no problem with guys working on their own rigs,my problem comes in when someone who clearly lacks any knowledge or idea of the right way,the accepted way to repair things,gives their 2 cents,which is quite wrong...what happens is others will follow this route,thinking it's an accepted way of doing things,then when a later date arrives and there's problems,someone with the proper knowledge and experience explains the problem,and tells exactly what's wrong and why it's wrong,along with exactly what caused a problem...
i'm not sure what you do or you did for a living,i'm guessing you're an older guy,but i suggest you stick with what you know,'cause clearly,you don't know too much about marine systems and the like,your words prove my point...you're probably a nice old guy,probably retired too,do yourself a favor,stick to giving advice about the proper golf swing,leave boats,and motors to someone who knows what they're doing.... :wink: :wink:

Nothing but insults. An absolute disgrace!

insults ??? read what i posted....if i see something that's not an accepted form of repair,then i point it out,nothing more,nothing less...advice given by this guy should not be followed...
think about this for a second...you follow this guys advice,you strip all the leads to the fuse holders,and crimp them all together into a single lug,you then connect this single lug to the battery...the inevitible happens,vibration actually loosens the crimp,one of these leads is the bilge pump,the auto switch fuse...it rains,the boat fills with water and sinks...the cause of the submersion is determined to be the connection at the battery...you followed this guys advice,you did something his way,the way i see it the advice giver should be responsible for the bad advice given...
there's quite a few things wrong with the response "bobp" gave,crimping a bunch of wires together into a single lug isn;t an accepted practice,it's not gonna hold up...making connections directly at the batteries isn't the best approach,the batteries should have cables for power to a control switch and grounds,nothing else,and another thing,batteries shouldn't have wing nuts,you should have lock nuts...
i perform repairs and give advice on repairs,following abyc codes,that means there's are done the correct way,the accepted way...now granted,there's more than one way to skin a cat,however,trying to reinvent the wheel isn't needed...
honda motor company had a print add a few years ago,it was a picture of a chair,the chair had a stick tied to it,in place of a leg...the caption under it said "sure it's fixed,but would you sit on it ??" this is kinda what we have here,in this discussion..bob has taken a few shots at me,read some of his posts,you'll see it,he doesn't come right out and call me wrong,he implies things...example,an aluminum part that has been galvanically corroded is structually fine,corrosion on a fuel tank is ok....everyone has the right to dissagree,everyone has a right to their own opinion-i have absolutley no problem with that...what i have a problem with is the poor advice given,some guys really don't know about things,they ask questions on a message board,looking for a correct answer,when someone gives them an answer,and that answer is incorrect,are you supposed to remain silent and allow that person to believe he's correct ??? here's another one....someone pm'd me asking me about a boat for sale on here,they asked my opinion...i gave it,i told what i knew first hand from the owner,i spoke with him concerning the problem,the opinion was,one of the engines has a knock,it's not good,plus the boat is over powered,i would stay far away from it...should i have not told anything ??? it's kinda like the same thing ??? we all want good free advice,right ??? i just like to see people get the correct advice...i realize i may be a little hard on people on occasion,but hey...i'm from new jerseywhatta ya want....