200 yamaha 2 cycle starting

[capt1947]

Hello all,

I am experiencing the following when I attempt to start my engine. Batteries are charged 12.9vdc. Turn key to start, the spring gear on the top of the starter spins but does not rise up to engage the flywheel.

I would appreciate your comments as to what may be the problem. ie new starter required, new return springs etc.?

Thanks,

 

[seasick]

Hello all,

I am experiencing the following when I attempt to start my engine. Batteries are charged 12.9vdc. Turn key to start, the spring gear on the top of the starter spins but does not rise up to engage the flywheel.

I would appreciate your comments as to what may be the problem. ie new starter required, new return springs etc.?

Thanks,

Did you remove the batteries and re-install? If so, check that all the cables that are supposed to be there are in fact connected, especially the thick one that connects the two negative battery terminal together.

It is also possible that you have a bad cell in a battery. The voltage may look good but the battery won't have enough oomph. Try switching/swapping batteries
You might have a bad connection at the battery, battery switch or motor connection ( especially the ground).
Finally the battery switch could be bad.

To diagnose, use a voltmeter and connect the negative to the negative battery terminal of the battery selected. Then connect the positive meter lead to the motor at the starter. Measure the voltage before cranking the motor. It should be normal. Start cranking and see how much the voltage drops. A volt or 2 is normal but a lot of drop indicates a problem. Rerun the measurements while moving the meter positive lead back towards the batterer ( connectors, battery switch etc) at some point the drop will not be a lot and that indicates that the problem is just after where you measured the change from lots of voltage drop to not so much.

Although the starter or Bendix drive could be bad, more often than not, the problem is low voltage

 

[capt1947]

Thanks for the reply.

I have done the following:
Batteries: 13vdc, good, clean terminals and secure connections.
Cabeling from batteries to selector switch are all good, clean and secure.
Good cable from sel. sw to the pos. terminal of the coil assy.
I have 13 vdc at pos coil terminal and ground to starter frame. I have utilized all of the positions of the selector switch and proved them to all work properly.
I DO NOT have 13 vdc at the starter pos terminal/same ground.

When I try to start with the key, I get 3.9 volts at the starter which is just enough to spin the bendix but not move it upwards.

I wonder if the coil could be bad? The wire from the coil to the starter is good, clean and secure.

I also have noticed that even with the battery at full charge, the tilt and trim motor ( new in November) runs slow.

I welcome your knowledge and comments.

Thanks

 

[capt1947]

Folks,

I made an error in calling the starter relay assemblies, coils. The terminals discussed in my previous post should have referred to them as relays. Sorry if there was any confusion.
Thanks

 

[seasick]

Thanks for the reply.

I have done the following:
Batteries: 13vdc, good, clean terminals and secure connections.
Cabeling from batteries to selector switch are all good, clean and secure.
Good cable from sel. sw to the pos. terminal of the coil assy.
I have 13 vdc at pos coil terminal and ground to starter frame. I have utilized all of the positions of the selector switch and proved them to all work properly.
I DO NOT have 13 vdc at the starter pos terminal/same ground.

When I try to start with the key, I get 3.9 volts at the starter which is just enough to spin the bendix but not move it upwards.

I wonder if the coil could be bad? The wire from the coil to the starter is good, clean and secure.

I also have noticed that even with the battery at full charge, the tilt and trim motor ( new in November) runs slow.


I welcome your knowledge and comments.

Thanks

You have excessive voltage drop due to added resistance from a bad relay, connection, connector or corroded terminal.
Measure the voltage at the input side of the starter relay with and without cranking. If it is close to the 3.9 volts you saw at the starter, you need to then move backward towards the battery. If the motor side is low and the battery side is not, the relay is bad, The next logical point is the common output terminal at the battery switch. Measure with and without cranking. If both low move to the input terminal of the battery switch. If low, then measure at the positive battery terminal itself.
At some point the difference between the two voltage points i going to be large and the wiring in between those two points will be the culprit. The fact that you feel that tilt and trim is slow tells me that the voltage is low there too and in that case, the starter and relay are not an issue.
I hate to repeat myself but are you sure there is a large gauge cable connecting the two battery negative terminals? When the batteries are removed and reinstalled it is easy and common to overlook one end of that jumper. I have done it myself and had the exact same symptom, bendix spin but not engagement.

 

[capt1947]

Thanks for your comments and knowledge. I will try to follow all of your suggestions and let you know the results.
Thanks again,

 

[capt1947]

Hi folks,

I wish to thank "Seasick" for his continued pragmatic approach to solving my electrical starting problem. As indicated in my previous post, I would follow his suggestions and let you know. Well he was right on the money. My problem was in the negative grounding all of the time.

I went through all of the connections and discovered that on one of the batteries there were three negative connectors stacked upon each other. Unless you removed them individually, you would never see the sandwich of corrosion on each terminal. After this I removed, cleaned, sanded and reinstalled all electrical terminals ,positive and negative from the batteries to the starter and relays. When completed, I applied wd40 to all work.

The starter and related system, including tilt/trim have never worked so well.

It is because of kind,patient and knowledgeable members of this forum that we are able to keep things going and improve upon them.

Thanks again Seasick and to the Forum.

Capt1947

 

[seasick]

Hi folks,

I wish to thank "Seasick" for his continued pragmatic approach to solving my electrical starting problem. As indicated in my previous post, I would follow his suggestions and let you know. Well he was right on the money. My problem was in the negative grounding all of the time.

I went through all of the connections and discovered that on one of the batteries there were three negative connectors stacked upon each other. Unless you removed them individually, you would never see the sandwich of corrosion on each terminal. After this I removed, cleaned, sanded and reinstalled all electrical terminals ,positive and negative from the batteries to the starter and relays. When completed, I applied wd40 to all work.

The starter and related system, including tilt/trim have never worked so well.

It is because of kind,patient and knowledgeable members of this forum that we are able to keep things going and improve upon them.

Thanks again Seasick and to the Forum.

Capt1947

Nice troubleshooting! Glad I could help.
Safe boating
Seasick