Bilge Switch Light (High Water Alarm?)

[lgusto]

Hi folks!

Reading about the Grady that capsized recently in the Chesapeake got me to thinking about another post I read on this site last year. Someone made a comment about adding some red LEDs to the dash in the helm area that would signal whenever the bilge pumps automatically came on.

This seems like an awesome idea since the factory switches light up but are not really bright enough to get your attention. Sort of an easy way to add a pseudo high water alarm to your boat without hanging upside down in the bilge.

Has anyone done this? Advice and/or pictures would be appreciated.

Thanks, Larry

 

[Curmudgeon]

Has anyone done this?

My '86 T-22 came with a switch panel that does this, but requires the float switch to be wired through the auto side of the dash switch ...

 

[LUNDINROOF]

That was me that was going to put the LED's on the dash. I am still going to do it but am waiting until February when it warms up down here. I plan to take pictures and post them when I do it.

 

[lgusto]

excellent idea! have you picked out the LEDs yet? Please send a link if so.

 

[fishingFINattic]

I installed a high water alarm in my 265 Express a few years ago.

I put the sensor in the rear bildge, and it will energize a big school bell alarm if I get two inches of water in the bilge.

It is wired direct to my spare battery, and I test it at the begin of the season and mid season.

I installed this after a relativly new cat overturned due to filling water one side with water while tuna fishing out of Venice.

I recall reading the first hand description of how this happened - it happened quick - and they did not expect it.

Tim

 

[lgusto]

Tim, I remember reading that story, certainly was an eye opener.

The independent HWA seems like the safest way to go because you'd REALLY want to know there's water in the bilge if the float switch fails. The big school bell is neat too because others at the dock would hear it if it happened there. Next time I'm hanging upside down doing something in the bilge I'll probably add one too.

Larry

 

[fishingFINattic]

Just for referance this is what I used:

http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?pat ... &id=744153

Tim

 

[LUNDINROOF]

That would definitely get my attention, and probably have me jump out of the boat when it went off. I might install this as a backup to the LED warning lights. I would install it about 6 inches above the float switch.

My primary system will be a little more sedate. It will not necessarily alert me if there is water in the bilge, but instead alert if the bilge pump starts running from the float switch.

I am going to "y" off the wire going from the float switch to the bilge pump, and run this wire to a LED mounted on the center console. The ground wire from the LED will go to the ground panel like the rest of the switches. When the float switch is activated by water, the circuit will be energised and the LED will light up.

This will let me know that the pump is working, meaning that there is water in the bilge but will also let me know if the float switch is stuck in the one position which is the problem that I had.

 

[lgusto]

Rather than a "Y" off the float switch why not a "Y" off the bilge switch already on the dash? On my boat there is a light inside each bilge rocker switch that comes on when the float switch is activated. I figured to just jump off of that. Any reason not to? Or are the switches on your boat different? Or do you just want a more redundant approach?

thanks

 

[fishingFINattic]

That would definitely get my attention, and probably have me jump out of the boat when it went off.

Actually the one time I heard this alarm I was puzzled at first.

We were on my buddies 46' Ocean taking waves hard and pushing threw some rough seas to get out and fish a shark tourny.

After an hour an half of hard running, waves over the bow, we started to hear this 1/4 second ring - and it was not to any pattern -

About the fourth or fifth ring we reliezed what it was, slowed the boat down and let the bilge pumps do there job.

Tim

 

[Enough Already]

I completed the LED visual indicator project a few years back. Purchased 2 LEDs from Radio Shack and drilled holes right below the actual helm switches. Lights press fit and have two wires coming off them. I ran the wires down to each bilge pump so that when the pumps are running, the LEDs light up on the helm (regardless of whether helm switch is on or not). Following is a scan of a really old Project sheet I think from a West Marine flyer. Sorry about the white stripe down the middle of it - must be decomposing . . . Worked great for me.

I like the idea of a separate bilge alarm and may tackle that project next.

 

[Grog]

Just noticed something in that drawing, why would you have a 3 position switch for the bilge pump? On or auto should be your choices, having an off position is asking for trouble. A high level alarm is on the list before the boat goes back in this year. Right now I'm leaning towards a high level alarm and another (larger) bilge pump wired to a switch by the helm.

 

[LUNDINROOF]

Igusto:
I think you might be right. I think I will try that first. I still have to drill for the LED's so if your idea doesn't work it will not cause any extra work. All this could be eliminated if the indicator lights on the switches were bright enough. I hope you are right.

I think my first Grady (1985 model) had a three position switch. My new one is two, on or off. The float switch is wired direct to the battery and cannot be turned off.

 

[Enough Already]

Just noticed something in that drawing, why would you have a 3 position switch for the bilge pump? On or auto should be your choices, having an off position is asking for trouble. A high level alarm is on the list before the boat goes back in this year. Right now I'm leaning towards a high level alarm and another (larger) bilge pump wired to a switch by the helm.

Good observation. My switch is only on/off and not 3-way. To the other poster, the internal switch light will only work when the switch is physically on. The LED approach is always on when the pump is running regardless of where the switch is set on or off. Re: drilling, use the tiniest drill bit first and then expand with a larger bit. A proper sized bit first will tend to "walk". Don't ask me how I know . . .

 

[Jeff Mauro]

EA, Thanks for the information on bilge pump alarm. Grady design usually keeps 99% of water out of the bilge. The only time there is a substantial amount of water is during an emergency like forgetting to install drain plug, cracked seawater pump, etc. I am going to install a audible alert. This can also alert others if there is a problem at the dock when the owner is not present. SONALERT Inc. makes 6-16 volt, low current draw audible alerts that can be installed like an LED. For those few times that the pump goes on in a non emergency the alert will sound for the 30 seconds +/- that the pump may activate. Again, thanks for the informative article

 

[lgusto]

Enough Already:

On my boat the switch light comes on whenever the float switch is activated, even when the bilge switch is in the "off" position. It's the OEM switch that came from Grady.

 

[LUNDINROOF]

Larry:
I have two reasons to want more warning when the float switch on either bilge pump is on.

First, the indicator lights on my switches do not show up very well in bright daylight. I want to know if the pump is running when I am out on the water. If my pump is coming on often, I know I have a problem.

Second, and this happened to me, when/if the float switch sticks in the on position, it back feeds power to the switch on the panel which energizes the entire panel and all the switches. This happens even if the main perko switches are on the off position.

So, dummy Ed pulls up to the dock, unloads and cleans boat, turns off both main power switches and walks to the camp and fixes a drink. Next day, before daylight, he looks down at the boat and notices that there are numerous indicator lights glowing on his switch panel even though he is absolutely sure he turned the power off on the boat. The bilge pump and numerous other accessories have been running all afternoon and night because of the back feed from the float switch. This I want to prevent.

Do you have a web site for your guide service? PM me if you do or send me some information.

Thanks
Ed

 

[Grog]

If the bilge switch is in auto (float switch) at the helm, it should not feed power to the other circuits because the switch is off. The LED will come on because power is being backfed from the float switch but power cannot go to the other circuits because of the switch. If the float is energizing the other circuits, there is a wiring problem. Bilge pump float switch power should not be after the battery disconnect, if the water level rises you want it to come on no matter what.

(it's crude but all I have at the moment)

if this is off it can't backfeed
^
Battery pos----------|--main disconnect----fuse at panel----(bilge pump switch)----indicator light-------|--------bilge pump
| (made in manual) |
in line fuse |
| |
|--------float switch----------------------------------------------------------------------------- |

 

[LUNDINROOF]

I do not have a three position switch on the bilge pumps, it is off or on. With the manual switch in the off position, if the float switch activates, it feeds power to the plus side of the manual switch. The plus side of all the switches get their power from one lead, so all the other switches are powered and the various accessories will work if you turn them on.

I questioned Grady about putting a diode in the wire going from the manual switch and the pump and they said it would work if properly sized. I was going to do it but after thinking about it, it would prevent the indicator light on the manual switch from lighting up when the pump ran. Although this light is hard/impossible to see in bright sunlight I do not want to eliminate it. I am going to use it to power the new LED's I am going to install.

 

[lgusto]

Ed, I'm perplexed by your description of the auto float switch energizing the entire panel. That doesn't happen on my boat, and not sure why it would happen on yours. I'd like to hear more about it.

My charter web site is http://www.dafishing.com. Thanks for asking.

Larry