Fisherman 222 Scuppers

[Gross Profit]

On the 222 I bought, the 4 scuppers plumbed to the floor drains (not the 2 larger ones in the motor well) need to be replaced. I am now trailering only but the previous owner stored it wet and all 4 holes are plugged up with barnacles and the flaps are distorted. My question is this. Should I clean them up and just replace the flaps or should I replace the entire assembly? What about those ping-pong ball type replacements? Should I consider that type? At rest, should those scuppers be below the waterline? Any advice is appreciated.

Billy

 

[gradyfish22]

How old ios the boat?? If it is mid 90's or older I would probably have the transom checked, those are known spots for transom rot to occur and often begin from. If it looks deteriorated, I would probably redo it all. I have no experience with the ping-pong flappers but have heard from a few who use them that they are not much better. The standard flappers should be fine if reinstalled correctly. Sounds like the previous owner did not pay a ton of attention to that area. There shouldn't be barnacles in that area, scuppers should be above waterline ideally. I would ask Jimmy from Jimmy's Marine who is a member of this forum, exactly how to go about replacing and fixing this situation

 

[Gross Profit]

It's a 1999 Model. Everything looks to be in really great shape although I have not had it professionally inspected. I can inspect inside from where they are and all looks very clean and dry. I would think (dangerous) that if they were leaky that I would see some evidence inside but I don't necessarily know what I'm looing at. Everything looks really great other than the barnacles growing inside there. These scuppers sure are low. It's hard to believe they would be very far above the waterline at rest by very far. If anyone has a '99 222 Fisherman please chime in as to where your scuppers sit when at rest.
Thanks

Billy

 

[Double Eagle]

I tried those ping pong ball jobs and ended up taking them off. I have a 228G and had to move my gas tank forward to the cuddy door so my scuppers would work right. They were under the water and wouldn't drain properly. It had too much weight in the back of the boat!!! All work down as per Grady!!!!

 

[BobP]

The drains on the transom called scuppers don't matter where they sit, what matters if you are getting wet feet inside the boat. No wet feet, no problem. The deck drain system requires maintenance and inspections.

Even a foot of water depth equals less than 1/2 psig pressure to the inside of of every square inch of the entre drain pass. So it's no challenge to keep water in the hose, and not bilge.

 

[gradyfish22]

Scupper location is important. Scupper's are designed to remove water from a boat at a high rate, a 1/2 psi is not enough to keep a boat from sinking, therefore the above info is incorrect. Yes I agree that having the cockpit dry is the most important thing, but if scuppers are underwater, you will have issues down the road unless you are constantly maintaining your transom and scuppers. Grady's are known for transom issues that start in 2 spots, scuppers and the metal trim at the topside of the scuppers. If either area deteriorates, water will get in. Having scuppers above the waterline where they were designed to be eliminates one of the issue. Having the scuppers in the water speeds up the deterioration of the piping and can cause leaks into the transom. Also, the cockpit drains have hoses running to the scuppers on some models, saltwater will deteriorate those hoses and if the scupper is underwater and not in perfect condition, your boat can and will sink. Grady does not design boats to have scuppers below the waterline, issues usually occur from repowers or when a new engine package comes out on an older model and the factory did not rectify the issue quick enough, they almost always do once they realize scuppers will be under water.

If your scuppers are underwater and your boat has not been repowered, then it may come from Grady that way. Not saying it is correct, but you will need to pay close attention to this area to keep your boat safe. I'd recommend on the engine box scuppers to coat the thru-hull pipe with 5200 or another product designed to seal in a marine environment. If you do have scuppers where hoses run from the cockpit drains to the scupper, check your hoses and make sure your scuppers work properly, as soon as you think they are not working correctly, replace them.

 

[Gross Profit]

Thanks for the info. It sure seems like a bad design to me but hey, I'm an air conditioning guy so what do I know. I will take the advice of maintaining them. They're bronze and seem in good shape but I may just replace them with stainless, new hoses and clamps, reseal to MY satisfaction and feel better about the situation. Thanks for the help.

Billy

 

[BobP]

The less than 1/2 psig is correct, it's actually 0.44 psig, depending on sea level and a few other factors. What's your number ?

This applies to concerns one has about the hose or fittings breaking free, rediculous claptrap.
The deck drain hose and fittings are under minute forces when they are underwater (below water line) vs. above.

The water-on- feet issue is related to the height of the deck relative to the water line, not where Grady placed the transom scuppers.

My transom scuppers are 3/4 below the water line at the dock with 1/2 capacity fuel load, and not a drop ever comes up the deck drains under any conditions out at sea, that's all I care about.

If your out fishing, look at the back of the boat, are the scuppers buried/ awash, look at the thru hull on the side of the boat that are above the bottom paint line, are they buried now. I presume you are not in a lake when you fish. No longer are they above the waterline when out at sea, you will find. Better be sure they are sealed for the wood's sake.

If the penetrations below the water line are a concern for the wood transom, get rid of the lower two engine mount bolt penetrations. That's four holes for the twins, and let us know how you accomplished it.

All penetrtations have to be sealed properly, even the side hull ones - there is wood coring behind the glass on the wide bodies.
The tank and well covers, hatch screws, hinges, hand railing, hardtop penetrations, hardtop frame mounts to deck and foredeck, rod holders, all penetrate into glass most places backed by wood, hundreds and hundreds of them, all have to be sealed solid.

Buy quality labeled hoses of the proper application, and they won't deteriorate in your ownership period, use double stainless clamps. No need to be afraid of them. Very simple concepts.

Every time you step on your car brakes, you are counting on a lot of hose and more complex hardware to stop your car. When was the last time you were concered the break hoses would fail when you stepped on the pedal?
A lot of pressure, real pressure in the brake lines and hoses, is driving the calipers.

And you are concered with a few hoses and fittings on the boat?

 

[gradyfish22]

Who cares about psi in the hoses, fact is hoses deteriorate, many boaters do not pay enough attention to them. Yes, under normal conditions you are correct it is not an issue, but the real world facts are owner's in many cases either do not upkeep much that they should, or unaware of what should be up kept. There are many out there who do take care of their boats, but even then failures occur in products. A hose below the waterline will fill the bilge, yes it will not flood the cockpit, but that is not the biggest source of sinking boats. How many boats sink at the dock tied up, the cause usually is a leaky hose. Your scuppers at some point may have water over them due to wave action, but a scupper below the waterline is incorrect. Most thru-hulls designed under the waterline have a sea cock to eliminate problems. They were designed to be under the waterline. Any other way is the wrong way. I'm a naval architect, I design boats, I know why scuppers and thru hulls are placed where they are and why. No designer placed a scupper in a location he knows will be underwater unless he made a big mistake of the boat was somehow altered. I'm not saying boats out there do not have scuppers underwater, it just is not correct and for most users posses a potential hazard.

 

[Gross Profit]

Luckily I trailer my boat which is a big plus as far as this situation is concerned. So now, thanks to this site I know I own a boat with at least one serious design flaw but being aware of it is comforting. I know what to do to minimize my risk. You can bet your bottom dollar that I'll check those things every week, and that's after installing the finest scuppers, hoses, clamps and sealant money can buy.

 

[BobP]

Gradyfish22,

Stay off inboard power boats, they have big bad hoses below the water line, BY DESIGN.

If the hoses/fittings are not maintained properly, ABOVE OR BELOW THE WATERLINE on the Gradys, the boat will be in serious trouble out at sea.

Who said Grady designed my boat to have scuppers above the water line ?
What defect ?
Are you guys making this crap up ?
Who doesn't know how to evaluate a 2 ft piece of 1.5 inch hose? If so concerned or unskilled, it's cheap enough, just replace it.

No insurance report I ever read was due to transom scuppers or hoses on them failing, it was the junk plastic ones on the sides near the water lines, or non-stainless clamps, I had several that failed.

Never ever install a sea cock on a deck drain, it will be the kiss of death when you leave it closed, by mistake, and leave the boat.

My boat was certified to industry standards, unless you are saying Grady falsified the boat plate certfication logo/markings and owners manual. I'll never believe that.

An improperly maintained boat is a hazard, period. No boat is maintenance free.

I' m glad you identified your professional status on this site

 

[Gross Profit]

I'm not trying to get anything started, I just asked if the scuppers should be below the waterline. It looks like that's the design, or if not that's the way it ended up. I'm really glad to have learned that it something that requires attention and maintenance. I really wouldn't have given it a second thought had I not stumbled across this site.

 

[Zebco33]

Billy, let me know how hard it is to replace the scuppers when you finish. I have the cheaper looking plastic ones and want to replace before the spring - I just bought my boat as well, 94 226. Did you buy your boat locally or from out of state. I was looking for a 209, 222, 226 or 228 94-2001.

I found a deal (well i was told and I think) at Bohicket marina from a guy who rarely used the boat.

 

[Gross Profit]

Billy, let me know how hard it is to replace the scuppers when you finish. I have the cheaper looking plastic ones and want to replace before the spring - I just bought my boat as well, 94 226. Did you buy your boat locally or from out of state. I was looking for a 209, 222, 226 or 228 94-2001.

I found a deal (well i was told and I think) at Bohicket marina from a guy who rarely used the boat.

Zebco,
I bought it in Wilmington and got what I also thought I got a good deal. Are you keeping it @ Bohicket? If you're going to fish offshore this year let's head out together sometime. I think it's going to be pretty easy to change them out on mine anyway. Seems to be pretty good access.

 

[gearadrift]

The bronze thru hulls are solid. You may need to change the flappers but I would not change the entire thru hull unless you suspect a problem. Ensure your hoses are in good shape from the inside, double stainless clamps on the fitting and replace the flaps. Your boat is not that old and came standard with top of the line thru hull fittings, I would leave it be until you suspect a problem.

 

[Gross Profit]

The bronze thru hulls are solid. You may need to change the flappers but I would not change the entire thru hull unless you suspect a problem. Ensure your hoses are in good shape from the inside, double stainless clamps on the fitting and replace the flaps. Your boat is not that old and came standard with top of the line thru hull fittings, I would leave it be until you suspect a problem.

I don't really suspect a problem other than what I've heard so far. I guess I could pull them out, inspect and if they're in good shape reseal them (which couldn't hurt). Thanks for the input, I appreciate it.

Billy

 

[Muffinman]

The bronze thru hulls are solid. You may need to change the flappers but I would not change the entire thru hull unless you suspect a problem. Ensure your hoses are in good shape from the inside, double stainless clamps on the fitting and replace the flaps. Your boat is not that old and came standard with top of the line thru hull fittings, I would leave it be until you suspect a problem.

I need to change the 4 flappers on my 2004 222 Fisherman, can someone tell me the exact size for the replacement and where i can find It, please.
I'm from Italy....i was hanging around on Gemlux website...
Ty
Giuseppe